[philc]

Hi, I'm the father of an 11 year old girl who is scheduled to enter secondary education in September 2008. She has been labelled as having moderate learning difficulties and significant dyspraxia. Our dilemma is which is the best secondary school option - mainstream with good special needs provision or special school. So far we have visited a special school and several mainstream schoools within the locality. Our daughter is statemented with 16 hours support. The annual review is looming where we will apparently be pushed to express our preferred choice of school - with october as the absolute deadline. Our main problem is that we are not clairvoyants and are having difficuly predicting the rate of progress she will make between now and Sep 08.

It would be great to hear from anyone who is (or has been) in a similar position - or anyone who has a view on this complicated issue !!! 

[johnvb]

Hi Phil,

Welcome to the forum! You're right, this is a really complex issue and with one child in a special school and one child in a mainstream school with a special needs base I'm not sure I can give a definitive answer.

A few questions spring to mind which might help a little. What kind of education has your daughter had so far? Has it been successful? Do you have a good special school in your area with children similar to your daughter? Is there a good mainstream school with the right attitude to special needs education nearby? Unfortunately for a lot of people the choice isn't possible because the education authority has made up their mind or the right type of schools just aren't available. Our daughter has to travel 25 miles to get the right  school!

The other thing I would say is that parents, Paula and I both have a gut feeling that our daughter will cope in a mainstream setting with the right support (she has mild-moderate learning difficulties, ADHD and some physical delays). However we also agree that our son would not cope at all well in a mainstream setting, partly because he has communication difficulties which mean that  he struggles to understand others and they struggle to understand him. We can see that the pace of any "mainstream" setting is such that he gets confused and upset. So its pretty obvious to us that special school is right for him at the moment.

Its an emotive topic so I hope some other readers will offer some opinions on the matter! Good luck with whatever you decide,

John

[philc]

Hi John

Thanks for the prompt and detailed response !

Anouska (our daughter) is currently in a mainstream primary school getting 16 hours per week support and is making good albeit slow progress. Her reading ability has really improved over the last few years and she is not far behind her peers in this respect (her comprehension of what she reads is somewhat further behind). Her writing remains one of her greatest challenges although this is also slowly improving with time. Our hope is that Anouska will 'get there' eventually albeit at her pace. Socially she is fine and incredibly manipulative which for now I'm viewing as a positive trait......!

There is currently a difference of opinion between Mum and myself re the best option for Anouska's secondary education. Mum feels that the local special school would be best whereas i feel that one of the local mainstream schools with an excellent special needs provision would suit her best. However we do both agree that the primary goal is Anouska developing successfully to meet the challenges the life will throw at her rather than being concerned about any academic achievement.

My concern with the mainstream option is that I'm struggling to understand on a day-to-day basis how Anouska will benfit nd flourish from being within an inclusice class setting where the majoity of the content and pace of the lessons will be 'over her head'. That said, my 1st choice of mainstream school didnt see this a particular problem - I wuld really like to witness a year 7 class setting where there are children with similar needs to Anouska's to how it works.

I really appreciate your feedback and  would like to return the compliment and offer any view or advice to you in return.   

We are meeting someone from the parent partnership organisation next week prior to Anouska's SRA on 5th July.   Do you have any experience of this organisation ?

[johnvb]

Hi Phil,

Not sure I can offer any more advice, other than perhaps try to find out if there are children similar to Anouska at any of the schools and see if you can meet the parents. The other option you could try for is a split placement so she can get therapy provision in the special needs school and mainstream integration in a mainstream school.

We had contact with Parent Partnership when we were trying to sort out our daughter's placement but didn't find them that helpful in our case. Our problem was that issues surrounding adoption and the need to integrate into a local community were not being considered and parent partnership felt that these issues should not really impact on the education placement. I guess it depends who you end up talking to and we have heard of other people who've had a very positive experience.

Keep in touch and let us know how you get on!

John

[paula]

Hi Phil! Nice to have you on the forum!

One thing John didn't mention is that you could ask to observe some lessons to try and get a feel for whether the school "pace" would be suitable for Anouska.

Take care,

Paula

[philc]

Dear Paula

Thanks for responding and a good idea - will suggest this to the school and keep you posted.

Cheers

Phil

[philc]

John

Thanks for this further advice - will be talking to the school in the near future and will keep you posted.

Hi Phil,

Not sure I can offer any more advice, other than perhaps try to find out if there are children similar to Anouska at any of the schools and see if you can meet the parents. The other option you could try for is a split placement so she can get therapy provision in the special needs school and mainstream integration in a mainstream school.

We had contact with Parent Partnership when we were trying to sort out our daughter's placement but didn't find them that helpful in our case. Our problem was that issues surrounding adoption and the need to integrate into a local community were not being considered and parent partnership felt that these issues should not really impact on the education placement. I guess it depends who you end up talking to and we have heard of other people who've had a very positive experience.

Keep in touch and let us know how you get on!

John

[welshie]

hi John

is it possible to take your daughtwer along to the schools your considering for say the morning?
My son daniel is dyspraxic with autistic tendencies we had a long hard battle with education authorites here from the word go practically.But Daniel is now happy in main stream school with support educationally he's doing very well and has just chosen his subjects for gcse's socially is a different matter he still has speach and languge problemsbut on a whole he's coping.
When Daniel was being intergrated into mainstream at junior school level we visited many a school we chose the school he then attended for these reasons
Firstly on my visit to the school they showed me a small group of children that get support and gave me an outline of what support they recieved.
secondly they gave daniel a tour of the school in a very friendly manner and offered more visits before he started
something else that was important to us was for my daughter to be given a placement within the same school as we were having problems with the school she was in Sarah has spld and wasn't getting the support as she wasnt statemented the school wasnt giving her any support,the 'new'school for Daniel took Sarah on and put in place support regardless to the fact it wasnt funded for the 1st year at least this showed us that the children were indeed important and not jut the funding.
I've probably gone off the subject slightly but feel free to get in touch we've had a child go from special needs to mainstream and children moving on to high school so if we can help will do gladly
Rachel x

[paula]

Really interested to hear your experiences Welshie - thanks! I couldn't agree more about he importance of taking your child along to see a school, if not on the first visit as it is difficult to concentrate and look your child but definitely on any subsequent visit. You really get an idea if your child will 'fit in' that environment and as you say, get an idea as to the reaction of staff. We recently looked around a supposedly very good special needs school for our daughter but were completely put off when a tour of the school turned into a sprint with my daughter getting stressed as she was being hurried along for the convenience of the Head! If the Head couldn't make allowances for my daughter, it did not inspire with me with much confidence for the rest of the school!
 
One thing that caught my attention in your post was the fact that you said that academically your son was doing really well but socially he was coping. Just interested about the academic / social balance which you have achieved and which you feel is the most important at the end of the day. Obviously our son is only six and this has not arisen but I sometimes wonder whether it is best to be a big fish in a small pond or the other way around?

[philc]

paula / welshie

Your query re the pro's and cons of big fish in a small pond or visa versa really struck a chord with me as this is one of the many dilemmas we curently face. Our shortlisted options for Anouska are either a special school with 100 pupils and classes of a maximum of 10 pupils or a mainstream with 1500 pupils and classes of 30 !

At the moment Mum is pro the special school option (6 miles from home) whilst I am pro the mainstream option (12 miles from home). My preference being primarily based on the gut feeling that I have re the teaching staff rather than facilities etc.

Visitng more schools this next week and have until 20th Oct to state our preference........any views on our situation would be very welcome.

[welshie]

hi paula/phil

my expereinces in changing schools is a very long story starting when Daniel was four.One of the special schools at that time were like that with us and imust say i refused that placement it didn't inspire me with confidence.The special needs school he entered was fantastic very thoughtful to how stressful it was for Daniel and opurselves we slowly went around the school with the head talking us and Daniel through the classes etc.
The school was four/six to a class with at least two adults teacher and assistant.
Great as a starting point but didn't exactly help his issues with larger groups of people and his social skills he also looked for that support at home which i found difficult to give him with having three to copewith alone.
In A way although Daniel came on in other areas we were pleased for him to leave and be 'small fish in a big pond' although apprehensive of how he'd cope.
Finding a mainstream setting that we thought appropriate was priority and we knew the school our other children were in wasnt the way to go.So we set about finding somewhere we thought would give us what we wanted for Daniel and also have a placement for Sarah,this turned out to be the fourth school we visited they gave us time and support before during and after the change over they gave bothDAniel and Sarah small group support even though Sarah hadnt gone through her statement on starting.

Regarding the aspect of doing well educational we are lucky with Daniel he works so hard in school partly because its his way of shutting others out and he likes to please the teacher.I'm not sure how to answer which i think is more important the only way i can put it is Sarah has difficulties academically but i know she can cope on work experience which means career wise in the rigtjob she should do fine.As for Daniel he may walk away with his GCSE's but he doesn't cope around people he doesnt well his speach is still poorand he needs to be given instructions one at a time and repetively thats not going to be so good in a work place i'm unsure what his future holds once he's finished education.

As for your son big fish little fish i think you have to be honest with yourself and trust you instincts of what is best for him.We were fully aware that Daniel copes well and is on the lower scale of autism with no behaviour problems in school which is why we felt he should be little fish in mainstream as some day he'l be able to live independantly.To have continued in special needs would not have prepared him for that.
Rachel

[paula]

Thanks for that  Welshie - really interesting.

You are so right about trusting your instincts as you know what is best for your child. It is so hard though isn't it as sometimes there is no obviously right school and in a way you have to go for the most suitable even though it may not be the ideal. Our son is in absolutely the right school for him, no question. Our daughter however is in a fantastic setting at the moment but we are unsure about the long term suitability of this school as we do not know how she will develop. Such a tricky one. Also as you say being in a mainstream environment is more real world than a special school as this is such a protected environment which is great to an extent but does present problems for integration in the future.

Basically it boils down to the fact that there is no right and wrong answer but we just have to do the best for our children and believe that the decisions we make at the time are the right ones for that time.

Paula